Why do Hahnemühle matte paper profiles show no out-of-gamut warnings in Lightroom soft proofing?
Asked 11/16/2015
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I'm comparing papers on a Canon PIXMA Pro-100 by printing the same black-and-white image with the same settings on several matte stocks. In Lightroom soft proofing, Canon's matte paper ICC profiles show significant out-of-gamut warnings, especially in darker tones. But when I use Hahnemühle's ICC profiles for several very different matte papers, Lightroom shows little or no gamut warning at all.
Does this mean the Hahnemühle papers truly have a wider printable gamut than Canon's matte papers, or can ICC profiles and rendering intent affect whether Lightroom shows gamut warnings? Why might very different Hahnemühle papers all appear to have no out-of-gamut areas?
Originally by Photography Stack Exchange contributor. Source · Licensed CC BY-SA 4.0
Photography Stack Exchange contributor
10y ago
2 Answers
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Out of gamut warnings have no well defined meaning using Perceptual Intent because all possible colors are supposed to be mapped to printable colors and compressed near the gamut boundaries. Ideally, the profile Perceptual tables can invert the printed color values to produce the originals.
Out of Gamut warnings are meaningful with Relative and Absolute Colorimetric intents because the specified color is printed so long as it is in gamut. If it isn't, the nearest printable color (usually based on delta E) gets printed. The Relative Col. tables in the profile then report back to the application the actual color printed. At least within profile, instrument and printer variance. When this actual differs from the requested color by an amount determined by the application, it may activate out of gamut masking or flagging.
However, How Perceptual tables in profiles are constructed is left to the profile designer and there are some major differences amongst printer OEMs. Canon normally does not perfectly invert Perceptual tables but instead, reports back the colorimetric value printed. Most other OEMs and profile software makers invert perceptual tables along the neutral axis.
As an example, Canon profile Perceptual tables can report back a L* value of 17 when an RGB value of 0,0,0 (black) is requested while a profile made by X-Rite or another paper supplier will almost certainly report back an L* of 0. Both actually print with a black at L*=17 in this example.
When printing using Relative Colorimetric, there is much more consistency between profiles from different vendors.
Originally by user58107. Source · Licensed CC BY-SA 4.0
user58107
7y ago
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The warning itself may be the main issue. In soft proofing, out-of-gamut warnings are most meaningful with Relative or Absolute Colorimetric rendering intents. With Perceptual intent, colors are typically compressed and remapped into the printer/paper gamut, so an out-of-gamut overlay may show little or nothing even when the original image contains colors the paper can’t reproduce exactly.
So, no warning does not automatically mean the Hahnemühle papers have dramatically wider gamut. It can also reflect how the ICC profile’s tables were built and how Lightroom interprets them for the chosen rendering intent.
Paper characteristics can still matter: coatings, base materials, and optical brighteners can affect gamut and tonal behavior. Different papers may genuinely perform differently, but the absence of a warning alone isn’t proof of superior gamut.
If you want a more meaningful comparison, check the profiles using Relative Colorimetric as well as Perceptual, and judge by the actual soft proof and print results—not just the gamut warning overlay.
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